The United Church of Canada is a very liberal organization that has questioned the deity of Christ, His resurrection, and virgin birth. It rejects the Bible as being verbally inspired by God. They face "a stunning 18-per-cent free fall in United Church membership" (MacLeans Magazine, Dec 1997 a great article describing a trend that has continued since then). It sees itself as an organization for important social issues (like this past summer's stand against bottled water), that is tolerant (except for conservative stands on theology and social issues), and open minded.
In light of all this, the United Church of Canada has launched a new advertising campaign. They have a number of controversial ads that they hope will provoke thought and discussion. They cover a number of areas such as parenting, homosexual marriage, how fun sex should be, the Bible, and Jesus.
Here is one of them:
"Want to explore your spirituality in a place that is as open-minded as you? Drop by wondercafe.ca and join in the discussion."
So I did.
Here is my first post on their Bible forum:
This ad boils down to the question “Did God really say…?”
People have been asking this question for a long time. In fact, it is the oldest trick in the book. Literally.
If the answer is yes:
then my disagreement is irrelevant. He is God and I am man. He is the perfectly loving and perfectly just Creator of me and everything else. If yes, then the Bible is God’s Word to man and we must accept the whole thing. If God said it, then our opinion must change to conform to His Word. We can’t change or disregard portions of His Word that do not conform to my opinion.
If the answer is no:
then the book is pointless and so is the church. Go find a secular social club to hang out in because the church has no authority and has nothing to offer but man’s opinions that are constantly changing. There are no real answers and everything truly is relative.
There can be no middle ground. No half and half. As unpopular as it may seem to this age of “tolerance”, it is either yes or no.
There have been a few responses and I have posted more replies to their forum over the last few days. I really don't know why anyone would bother to attend a service at the UCC. It seems so... empty.
_____________________________________________
In light of all this, the United Church of Canada has launched a new advertising campaign. They have a number of controversial ads that they hope will provoke thought and discussion. They cover a number of areas such as parenting, homosexual marriage, how fun sex should be, the Bible, and Jesus.
Here is one of them:
"Want to explore your spirituality in a place that is as open-minded as you? Drop by wondercafe.ca and join in the discussion."
So I did.
Here is my first post on their Bible forum:
______________________________________________
This ad boils down to the question “Did God really say…?”
People have been asking this question for a long time. In fact, it is the oldest trick in the book. Literally.
Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?" Genesis 3:1Satan used this question to plant doubt in Eve’s mind about the authenticity of what God had said. “Did God really say??” She chose to believe Satan rather than God.. with disastrous results. This is a question of the authority and authenticity of God’s Word. Satan has been using this same trick throughout the ages, and now The United Church of Canada is now asking us.. “Did God really say?”
If the answer is yes:
then my disagreement is irrelevant. He is God and I am man. He is the perfectly loving and perfectly just Creator of me and everything else. If yes, then the Bible is God’s Word to man and we must accept the whole thing. If God said it, then our opinion must change to conform to His Word. We can’t change or disregard portions of His Word that do not conform to my opinion.
If the answer is no:
then the book is pointless and so is the church. Go find a secular social club to hang out in because the church has no authority and has nothing to offer but man’s opinions that are constantly changing. There are no real answers and everything truly is relative.
There can be no middle ground. No half and half. As unpopular as it may seem to this age of “tolerance”, it is either yes or no.
2 Timothy 4:3I say yes, God really did say..
For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
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There have been a few responses and I have posted more replies to their forum over the last few days. I really don't know why anyone would bother to attend a service at the UCC. It seems so... empty.
"But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. People... having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them."end rant.
2 Timothy 3:1-5
Labels: Rants
i read some of your posts and peoples comments, and looked at some ads on that site. people dont realize the enormity of what they are saying when they say things like "I'll take the Bible the way I want to, you take it your way."
i have thought of passages in 2Tim lately too in relation to things i see around me.
Well said Julie.
I couldn't believe it when one person replied: "I fully believe in the bible, but I can't take it literally - why? BECAUSE I READ IT!"
That prompted me to ask him if he believed in heaven, and if he hoped that he would be going there. And if he did, what did he base it on.
If you reject Genesis 3:16, how can you be trusting in John 3:16?
What made you think this person was rejecting that particular passage?
maybe I should just go read it. :)
He didn't say he rejected Genesis 3:16, but if you claim to not take the Bible literally, then they almost certainly reject the whole creation and global flood accounts. And when you start picking and choosing what is true and what is a fairy tale.. how can you trust any of it? And if you can't trust any of it, where is our hope for salvation??
Jesus and the NT authors certainly treated all of Genesis as literal, historical truths.
OK, I "read" some of it. I tried to read anything you wrote and anyone who said your name in their response. I may have missed something, but I still don't get the Genesis 3:16 reference. I tried to comment on there, but i couldn't see a registration option (probably becuase I don't have flash at work). Anyway, I wanted to respond because I have read books by John Shelby Spong. He is one of my least favourite varieties of the "intellectual intimidation" process of disproving things. i.e. "anyone who believes this is stupid". Well, I wouldn't want to be called stupid, so I better spout whatever this guy writes, or else I'll be stupid. I could rant about this twit forever. So I won't. Anyway, what's with Genesis 3:16?
OK, Genesis 3:16 just seemed like a weird verse to choose. But if it was random, that makes more sense.